Karma Function Removed

[Jack]

Well that's nice, I was at 99.   All those attempts to be amusing and helpful, in the hopes of one day achieving the magic triple digit karma, all hope dashed.  Fine.  Now you'll see the real me.  Stupid, unhelpful, posting drunk in my underwear at ten in the morning.  Not even using the spell checker!

[Andrew]

The database fields containing the karma are unchanged.  Just the interface to see and affect it is turned off.

The karma system is intended to be a fun thing.  It also helps to remind us to say, "Hey, good post.  Thanks." to others.  However, in the space of 6 months it has been systematically abused three times.  I've already banned 2 accounts permanently due to this round, and there might be more bans coming.

Here is the problem with the current system:  I cannot reliably prevent abuse that is disruptive to the good of the overall community.  By design, SMF's karma log clears itself at regular intervals - only the awarded karma (the -1 or +1 total; not who awarded it, when it was awarded, or anything else) is maintained in the database as a permanent record.  

Unless I check the karma log regularly, I cannot prevent further abuse.  And I do consider giving every poster who posted in a thread negative karma abuse, especially when it appears collusion or even patsy accounts were involved.  

I cannot check the log regularly.  I am barely keeping up with my family and USMC commitments, and they are not going to abate any time in the near future.  Until a karma system is available that will help to prevent abuse, the function is disabled.  There is a mod that looks promising, but it is not approved for our version of SMF, and would require testing and me modifying it before it could be used.  Again, right now I do not have the time for that effort.  

More than anything, the karma is there to remind us to say, "Good post." or to provide feedback for behavior that is "good" or "bad."  When you get down to it, we all get to know each other through our posts.  When I look at you, Ash, I do not see a karma total.  I see you, as I have grown to know you over the years.

[Jack]

Andrew, I was just kidding about the whole not using the spell checker thing 

I do have to say though, it does suck.  Apparently this is all about political posts?  People post about politics, other people have made it clear they don't like that, so they continue to post about politics.  Then they complain when their karma goes down, so teacher takes everybody's karma away.  Seems to me that if you don't want your karma to go down, you could exercise a littel self-control and post that stuff somewhere else.  Go over to a political board and post about bad movies all the time, see what they think of you there.

[Derf]

I sign off and go to bed early, and when I come back, what do I see? Shenanigans! Hooligans lollygagging with their tomfoolery! 
I guess I had been staying away from the more volatile discussions; I hadn't noticed that anyone had been abusing the system. Sorry to see it happen, especially here; as I have said before, this is the only forum I contribute to regularly (or at least I hope I contribute), mainly because of the level of civility. I always tried to let a person know when I applauded them (I don't recall ever booing anyone). Ah, well, back to practicing written communication skills...

And on a side note, Andrew, I appreciate all the time and effort you put into this site above and beyond all of your other responsibilities; I don't know how you manage. I'm sorry that some kiddies can't play nice and that grown-ups occasionally have to step in and yell the internet equivalent of "Okay! Everybody out of the pool!" Anyway, do what you've got to do, and meta-karma to you for your efforts.

[Menard]

With all due respect to Menard, suggesting that someone who posts negative karma is a p***y is, to me, no less a defence mechanism than hiding behind an anonymous 'boo' button. I'm not so quick to discount criticism that goes unspoken. The sentiment is still there, even if someone wouldn't express it to my face. To keep that sentiment hidden doesn't make sense to me. I see it as denial. People don't stop being p**sed off just because they find it intimidating to say something.

I'm glad I get so much respect, then surreptitiously get called a p***y.

Bluntly:

If someone does not have the balls to speak their mind, voting anonymously behind someone's back makes them no less of a p***y than what they are; regardless of what kind of sympathy you want to caress them with.

People will overcome intimidation if the ability to hide behind something is not there; they will never overcome it so long as the ability to hide continues to exist.


Love ya, babe...mwha.

[Menard]

Seems to me that if you don't want your karma to go down, you could exercise a littel self-control and post that stuff somewhere else.

Doesn't that just sound a little...uh...Mafioso?

Kind of comes off as saying that some want to hide behind the karma system as a punishment for those who actually speak their minds.

BTW, nice use of the spell checker.

[Mr. DS]

I'm at work and I've only skimmed the posts so sorry if this has been brought up.  Is there a way to disable negative karma and only have positive karma points? If possible, this could very well be a happy medium.  For example, if you don't like a post, don't give them karma and voice your opinion. 

[Menard]

I much prefer the concept of 'if you have something to say, say it'.

[Patient7]

Just curious...

If the karma feature is reinstated, will our karma be reset to zero or will it be back where it was?
I had something like 246 karma and for most of it, I had to work hard and write creatively to get it.

It isn't fair to all the rest of us who use the karma function like it's supposed to be used.  We lost it because of the actions of a couple of idiots and they should be punished for it...not us. 
Essentially, you've punished everyone on the entire board.
(at least that's how I see it)

Welcome to what many establishments for small children call fair, sorry I watched a comedian last night who mentioned not being able to go to recess because one kid couldn't read.  

The database fields containing the karma are unchanged.  Just the interface to see and affect it is turned off.

The karma system is intended to be a fun thing.  It also helps to remind us to say, "Hey, good post.  Thanks." to others.  However, in the space of 6 months it has been systematically abused three times.  I've already banned 2 accounts permanently due to this round, and there might be more bans coming.

Here is the problem with the current system:  I cannot reliably prevent abuse that is disruptive to the good of the overall community.  By design, SMF's karma log clears itself at regular intervals - only the awarded karma (the -1 or +1 total; not who awarded it, when it was awarded, or anything else) is maintained in the database as a permanent record.  

Unless I check the karma log regularly, I cannot prevent further abuse.  And I do consider giving every poster who posted in a thread negative karma abuse, especially when it appears collusion or even patsy accounts were involved.  

I cannot check the log regularly.  I am barely keeping up with my family and USMC commitments, and they are not going to abate any time in the near future.  Until a karma system is available that will help to prevent abuse, the function is disabled.  There is a mod that looks promising, but it is not approved for our version of SMF, and would require testing and me modifying it before it could be used.  Again, right now I do not have the time for that effort.  

More than anything, the karma is there to remind us to say, "Good post." or to provide feedback for behavior that is "good" or "bad."  When you get down to it, we all get to know each other through our posts.  When I look at you, Ash, I do not see a karma total.  I see you, as I have grown to know you over the years.

Wow, you do a lot for this thread  

I sign off and go to bed early, and when I come back, what do I see? Shenanigans! Hooligans lollygagging with their tomfoolery! 

That would get karma, ooooooooooooh, curses!  Seriously, shenanigans is one of my favorite words and I do not lie about that, so it would get karma.

When I look at you, Ash, I do not see a karma total.  I see you, as I have grown to know you over the years.

Right now when I look at Ash I see Godzilla.


In the end I suppose until we can track down these SOBs and torture them with reading really long posts we cannot have vengance.

[Doc Daneeka]

Dang, I kinda liked that; oh well, to those pricks that were attacking each other with boos...

YOU SUCK!!!   

It was more along the lines of a few members gangbanged a single member's karma.

Poor Wyrewizard...

My final tally = 90 :)

[Raffine]

Again:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y75iORH3qS0

[ghouck]

With all due respect to Menard, suggesting that someone who posts negative karma is a p***y is, to me, no less a defence mechanism than hiding behind an anonymous 'boo' button. I'm not so quick to discount criticism that goes unspoken. The sentiment is still there, even if someone wouldn't express it to my face. To keep that sentiment hidden doesn't make sense to me. I see it as denial. People don't stop being p**sed off just because they find it intimidating to say something.

I'm glad I get so much respect, then surreptitiously get called a p***y.

Bluntly:

If someone does not have the balls to speak their mind, voting anonymously behind someone's back makes them no less of a p***y than what they are; regardless of what kind of sympathy you want to caress them with.

People will overcome intimidation if the ability to hide behind something is not there; they will never overcome it so long as the ability to hide continues to exist.

Or from reading posts like this, they're not keen on receiving a backlash of hate and insult, yet they feel the need to use the system that is there to show their response. I remember when you deleted your account: Someone dropped a boo on you, and you got insulting and stormed out. You said you wanted an explanation, and the first thing 'I' thought was "Who would bother?, this has very little chance of not getting ugly, what adult wants to go through all that?". This should not be taken this serious, and as I see it, it rarely is, I've not been dinged for any of my stupid comments or retarded spelling/grammar. 

I do remember when I first came to this board, I clicked on either a + or a - Karma button simply because I didn't know what it was. To whoever that was: I'm sorry, and I appreciate the fact you didn't take it personally. If I could figure out who that was, I'd undo it, but either way, I'm sure everything is OK.

Personally, I feel I can, upon receiving neg, look back and see how I've been offensive, or violated the rules, etc. If I can't find that, then BFD, I'm just not going to worry.

Poor Wyrewizard...

Was he back?

Personally, I think the WW situation was a bit unique: The guy repeatedly insulted the entire group as a whole, While it became apparent through his own words that he didn't like b-movies to begin with. One can conclude that all he was here for was to insult others. The Karma system only allowed Karma once a day or so, and he was dishing out group insults much more often than that.

[Menard]

I remember when you deleted your account: Someone dropped a boo on you, and you got insulting and stormed out.

Try ten someones.

I have already, and quite unnecessarily explained what happened, and if people want to continue to believe their pre-conceived notions either out of inability to read, lack of concentration when reading, or just plain stupidity, I don't owe an explanation to anybody.

[ghouck]

I remember when you deleted your account: Someone dropped a boo on you, and you got insulting and stormed out.

Try ten someones.

I have already, and quite unnecessarily explained what happened, and if people want to continue to believe their pre-conceived notions either out of inability to read, lack of concentration when reading, or just plain stupidity, I don't owe an explanation to anybody.

You just made my point in reference to someone trying to avoid insult, and, the number of negatives that were left wasn't the only point I was making.

[Menard]

I remember when you deleted your account: Someone dropped a boo on you, and you got insulting and stormed out.

Try ten someones.

I have already, and quite unnecessarily explained what happened, and if people want to continue to believe their pre-conceived notions either out of inability to read, lack of concentration when reading, or just plain stupidity, I don't owe an explanation to anybody.

You just made my point in reference to someone trying to avoid insult, and, the number of negatives that were left wasn't the only point I was making.

I should specify that the reply I made, though to your post, was not aimed at you; it was a generalization. My apologies if I gave you the impression otherwise.

It seems as though several members have already made comments that my leaving had to do with the karma issue, and, being that the karma is presently gone, that somehow means that I can become a member again; neither is the case.

I came on this board and provided an explanation for the sole purpose that Andrew had thought that I was upset with him, and that was not the case, and it was my responsibility to clear it up.

I did that, and anybody is simply going to believe what they want to believe; and it's not going to make an ounce of difference one way or another.